So I Posted on a Chinese Message Board
A few weeks ago I stumbled upon a Chinese message board that had comments on my blog, and more prominently, a few others (Danwei, CLB etc.) I dutifully posted the comments on Cup of Cha, but when I went back, I noticed that one of the Chinese posters had copied my post, making it available on that site. This resulted in the curious, but interesting, situation of foreigners peering into a Chinese message board, and Chinese reading up on the English blogs.
A couple of the comments to my entry were from Chinese people, and they helped clarify some of the shorthand used (like the use of the term ‘Mark’ for example). After a little while, I got the courage to post a medium-sized comment about their thoughts, particularly of the posted named ‘zxiang’ who originally commented on my blog and seems to be the leader of the board in some form. What I was most interested in was why he thought I was ‘brainwashed’ by the western media, my thoughts were simplistic and which post of mine he had read (he was not specific).
The answer to these questions were extremely interesting. First, he told me that the post he was referring to was one I wrote entitled China Should Forgive American Debt. That in itself surprised me, because it is one of the posts I like best on the new site. However, when zxiang replied he also mentioned that he went back a re-read it and realized that it was satirical, and not serious. Ironically a number of Americans also seemed to think that I was actually advocating Chinese forgiving of US debt, which I find a baffling conclusion to reach for a native English speaker (the piece begins, “I’m tired of all of the whining from poor African countries about their debt.”) However, for a non-native speaker who took a quick glance, it makes much more sense.
So, as it turns out, my thinking is only simplistic if taken at face value. As satire I’m a genius (my words, not his). I have this strange feeling that a couple of years from now Little Bush, as the Chinese call him, is going to make the same claim about every speech he’s ever made.
Another notable comment that I posted was in response to a strange give and take. I noticed that someone posted something in German, and at least two Chinese people seemed under the impression that it was English, but really difficult. That seemed sad that their English skills were not adequate to understand the meaning. Well, I clarified the situation with the following statement:
你们不明白不是英语的问题，就是德语的问题。
For those of you who speak Chinese well you might notice that there is a grammar mistake. Well, either way, not only did people on the message board notice, they gave me a free grammar lesson. One person explained:
不是。。。就是。。。用得不对。应该换成 不是。。。而是。。。前者表达选择的意思，后者才是表达转折的意思。呵呵，不知道我说清楚了没？
Another, apparently concerned that I might miss the critical point in the explanation made it even more clear:
“你们不明白不是英语的问题，而是德语的问题。”
应该是这样子，^^
So if you’re scoring at home, when you want to say “It isn’t this, rather it is this” the correct Chinese construction is:
“不是。。。，而是。。。”
Qi Laoshi would be so disappointed in me. But hey, it’s not like Cup of Cha isn’t chock full of typos!
Anyway, the whole experience has inspired me and I’ve been reading a lot of Chinese blogs and will try to get involved in some more postings…when I can follow the conversations properly anyway.
Larry responds:
Posted: January 7th, 2008 at 12:58 am →
When Chinese readers read something from foreigners that is not 100% glowing for China, their excuses they usually come up are:
1. Westerners don’t understand China
2. Westerners are brain washed
3. Westerners are out to get China
4. There are bad things in the west too
5. China is changing fast
6. China is big, anything can happen
Too many of them are satirically deficient too.
Oh, I like short sentences. Your “你们不明白不是英语的问题，而是德语的问题。”
may be shorten to “你们不明白的不是英语,而是德语”。 Note: The “的” gives your “不明白” an object, and also gives “不是” a subject. Your “问题” probably pointing to their problem with language, which also imply they have one. I rather just point out the language difference instead of implying them having a problem.
Shopgirl shanghai responds:
Posted: January 7th, 2008 at 2:19 am →
those are not excuses my dear…
Zhang Xi responds:
Posted: January 7th, 2008 at 4:41 am →
However, when zxiang replied he also mentioned that he went back a re-read it and realized that it was satirical.
————————————
I didn’t see this. I just posted on your another article. It was some harsh words, and I am sorry for that.
Larry responds:
Posted: January 7th, 2008 at 12:58 am →
1. Westerners don’t understand China
————————————
I read Newyork Times online. Everytime when there are news from China, they’re always like:
“coal mine collapse again”
“the air of Beijing is so dirty”
“religious are imprisoned”
Even when reporting the miracle of economics, they say
“Evil China is threatening the world, let’s justicial countries ban their export.”
You can see the reason here. I’ve never found any article has positive or even impartial view of China. So it is hardly to believe the claim that Westerners know China.
However, I understand this. It creates inaccuracy when you see something so far away. We have the same situation in China. Conversely, most Chinese, specially young people, consider Western Countries as paradises. Which is not too different from China in my point of view.
Merlin responds:
Posted: January 7th, 2008 at 8:35 pm →
Josh。因为那个帖子是在八卦版，95%是女性，所以不会有很多人回应，特别是关于政治的东西（除了韩国）。如果是在天涯国际观察里就不一样了。
Hehe responds:
Posted: January 8th, 2008 at 9:45 pm →
“你们不明白不是英语的问题，而是德语的问题。”
I think the above sentence is still questionable.
“你们不明白这不是英语的问题，而是德语的问题。”
“这”or something similar is necessary to make the sentence correct in grammar.
Josh responds:
Posted: January 8th, 2008 at 10:49 pm →
@Zhang Xi
First of all, the criticism of the US press is ALWAYS that it only reports negative stories. You gave the example of when coal mines collapse. When seven workers get trapped in the US there is non-stop coverage for a week. When 150 die in China it gets a 15-second mention on the American broadcast.
Secondly. I think people are often sensitive to criticism of their own country, often at the expense of objectiveness. Look at the three examples you gave:
“coal mine collapse again”
“the air of Beijing is so dirty”
“religious are imprisoned”
The first I’ve touched on. The second is arguably the most critical problem facing China today because it has the potential to kill off a generation of people (and as I write this I can literally smell the pollution through my open window), and the last example about imprisonment of religious figures seems like a legitimate argument. Am I missing something? It’s not like there is any shortage of stories on the Chinese economic miracle (which is sometimes known as capitalism).
nanheyangrouchuan responds:
Posted: January 9th, 2008 at 3:57 pm →
Why should the press make glowing reports about China? That is what MNCs are for and if they don’t they’ll start having some tax and licensing troubles in the PRC.
Jeremiah responds:
Posted: January 9th, 2008 at 10:16 pm →
I think that if many Chinese read American journalism about America, they might consider that to be needlessly negative as well. That criticizing one’s own country might not be deemed unpatriotic, indeed that thoughtful criticism could actually be a patriotic act in itself, is an idea I’ve had some trouble explaining to Chinese friends and associates.
Mao once said that revolution is not an invitation to dinner. Well, journalism is not cheerleading practice.
I do think that the foreign media can be a bit over the top in their negative reporting on China. That said, only a fool or true lackey of the state would argue that the Chinese media is permitted to adequately report on domestic problems and issues. Somebody has to do it, China’s problems are not going to magically disappear just because somebody wants to wish them away.
There have been many horrific problems in American history–racism, poverty, corruption, crime, foreign military misadventures, environmental degradation, you name it. We still grapple with them to this day. But it would be difficult to argue that any of these problems would have been made better had the state prohibited the media from discussing the issues openly.
Finally, it should be noted that for all of the whinging in China about “negative reporting,” the Chinese media never gives a second thought to reporting on negative news from abroad (instability, crime, scandal, death, mayhem, what have you).
Anyway, kudos to you for choosing to engage across the blogging divide. Hopefully, more will follow your lead in both directions. Great post.
林lin responds:
Posted: October 30th, 2008 at 5:55 am →
语言和态度决定了人们对事物的正确理解。互相学习重要。